Could my noise complaint be considerd vexatious? | Neighbour noise | Flat Chat Forum: Your Questions Answered




A A A

You must be registered and logged in to reply to posts or post new topics. Click on "How to Use This Forum" for simple instructions on how to get on board. NB: Please do not use your real name or email address as your screen name - if you do it will be changed to something less insecure.

Avatar

Please consider registering
Guest

Search

— Forum Scope —




— Match —





— Forum Options —





Minimum search word length is 3 characters - maximum search word length is 84 characters

Register Lost password?
sp_Feed sp_PrintTopic sp_TopicIcon
Could my noise complaint be considerd vexatious?
Avatar
reddant
FlatChatter
Members
Forum Posts: 11
Member Since:
18/09/2017
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
1
08/12/2017 - 8:07 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

Read lots of views about noise in Flat Chat, including that some people who complain about noise are unreasonable.

I asked two neighbours to the left of me, who are next door neighbours who have become friends, to moderate their noise this week, but they thought me unreasonable. What’s your view?

– Both of them leave their unit doors open with their TVs on, and talk  very loudly when one is visiting the other.

– deaf guy has his TV on very loud with his unit door open and does so for extended periods most evenings lately, including once at 2.00 am on a weeknight. Can hear it in my home and it is deafening in the corridor – like a rock concert.

– stands in corridor most of the evening and at least once during the day talking to his next door neighbour, and as he is deaf talks very loud. Coridoor is outside my window and even closing all the windows of my home does not muffle the noise enough which is intrusive. I tried to shut the common property windows too, but these neoghbours got angry and told me they were “their” windows and that I had to ask first.

These people are not living discretely inside their home, they are living as if in a share house including in the corridor too!

Avatar
BONNIE L
Flat(chat)Mate
Members
Forum Posts: 62
Member Since:
19/10/2016
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
2
09/12/2017 - 9:34 am
sp_Permalink sp_Print

Could depends on how you get on with the nearby neighbours generally, and with others in the building; perhaps some are disturbed also.

Have you checked if there are by-laws in your building concerning breaches with others privacy.

As well, if you have a strata managing agent, they may assist.

In my experience, local council also has had noise abatement rangers. This sounds like a neighbour concern though.  

Avatar
JimmyT
Admin
Forum Posts: 4727
Member Since:
06/01/2014
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
3
09/12/2017 - 9:57 am
sp_Permalink sp_Print

Firstly, a vexatious complainer or litigant is someone who is constantly taking action against others, often knowing they have little or no chance of success, purely because of the the disruption having to defend themselves cauises the other people. You are nowhere close to that, even if you persist with a legitimate complaint.

There will almost certainly be a by-law that prevents people from causing a nuisance on common property, as well as laws that forbid people from interfering with the peaceful enjoyment of their lot.

You really want to nip this in the bud but it sounds like these people are not particularly reasonable so it may be hard to avoid it escalating.

A polite letter expressing your concerns might be the first step but it may alsu light the fuse.

After that, send a letter to your committee but be prepared to take the matter to Fair Trading for mediation (which is now free).

After mediation your choice is to go to a Tribunal or to seek orders at your local court.

In the past the police have told us that excessively loud voices at the wrong times in the wrong places can be subject to noise abatement orders.

Regarding the  “common property” windows – please tell me they weren’t the windows of their homes! They may be common property but you aren’t entitled to touch them.

Avatar
scotlandx
StrataGuru
Members

Full Members

Moderators
Forum Posts: 780
Member Since:
02/02/2012
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
4
09/12/2017 - 5:18 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

Complaints about other people are fine and reasonable, complaints about you are just plain vexatious.  Of course they are going to say you are vexatious, they don’t want to consider that they are doing anything wrong.

But seriously – having your TV on at full blast and leaving the door open is highly likely to disturb other people, and it is not reasonable to stand in the hallway talking at the top of your voice.  As the OP says, it seems that the offenders are using the common property as quasi-living space.

My downstairs neighbour recently got a new TV, and I had to point out to her that the sound is so loud that it reverberates through my floor.  She didn’t know, so she has taken steps to keep it down to a reasonable level.  As I type this there are children screaming in the courtyard, but that is a whole other story….

Avatar
reddant
FlatChatter
Members
Forum Posts: 11
Member Since:
18/09/2017
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
5
09/12/2017 - 7:46 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

JimmyT said

Regarding the  “common property” windows – please tell me they weren’t the windows of their homes! They may be common property but you aren’t entitled to touch them.  

No, the common property windows I’m referring to are in the hallway, not in the lots of the two neighbours. It’s outrageous that this occupant said they they are “theirs” because they are outside their apartment.

Avatar
reddant
FlatChatter
Members
Forum Posts: 11
Member Since:
18/09/2017
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
6
09/12/2017 - 8:07 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

I think any court or tribunal would find that people are allowed to stand around in the coridioir or on common property all day if they like, as long as they’re not doing anything else wrong, such as unreasonable noise or obstructing others on common property.

Never heard of loitering on common property as prohibited, have you?

This is a social problem we’ve had from time to time with tenants who don’t work and who have a disability and are socially disadvantaged as a consequence. They spend too much time on common property and are claustrophobic.

The overarching solution is to manage the building in a way that attracts top quality occupants instead. When the building is run down and not run properly (as our is) poor tenants live here and this is what you get.

I’ve searched everywhere and there is no external action you can take against people invading your concept of personal space or privacy.

I think that suggestion of writing a polite letter might be a next step. I’ll just tell them how I feel and ask them to take it on board.

Avatar
scotlandx
StrataGuru
Members

Full Members

Moderators
Forum Posts: 780
Member Since:
02/02/2012
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
7
10/12/2017 - 1:25 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

I’m not sure social engineering is the answer to the OP’s issue.

If the resident’s behaviour is interfering with the owner’s reasonable enjoyment of their property, then they have grounds for complaint.

153 OWNERS, OCCUPIERS AND OTHER PERSONS NOT TO CREATE NUISANCE

 

(1) An owner, mortgagee or covenant chargee in possession, tenant or occupier of a lot in a strata scheme must not:

(a) use or enjoy the lot, or permit the lot to be used or enjoyed, in a manner or for a purpose that causes a nuisance or hazard to the occupier of any other lot (whether that person is an owner or not), or

(b) use or enjoy the common property in a manner or for a purpose that interferes unreasonably with the use or enjoyment of the common property by the occupier of any other lot (whether that person is an owner or not) or by any other person entitled to the use and enjoyment of the common property, or

(c) use or enjoy the common property in a manner or for a purpose that interferes unreasonably with the use or enjoyment of any other lot by the occupier of the lot (whether that person is an owner or not) or by any other person entitled to the use and enjoyment of the lot.

Avatar
confused1
FlatChatter
Members
Forum Posts: 23
Member Since:
21/08/2012
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
8
11/12/2017 - 11:43 am
sp_Permalink sp_Print

In my building its against fire regulations to leave your front door open, if that’s the case in yours they are in breach.

Could you at least solve the loud TV issue by bringing this up with the OC?

Avatar
reddant
FlatChatter
Members
Forum Posts: 11
Member Since:
18/09/2017
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
9
23/12/2017 - 8:02 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

confused1 said
In my building its against fire regulations to leave your front door open, if that’s the case in yours they are in breach.

Could you at least solve the loud TV issue by bringing this up with the OC?  

Thanks confused1. After reading your suggestion here, I conducted a visit by a fire consultant, which was already.arranged. I asked him in a follow up email. He confirmed in writing that leaving ones door open as a permanent state and installing a fly screen door to do so is a breach of fire order. 

So thanks.

These tenants are still doing it. I am spending Christmas taking sneak videos and writing a noise log as requested by my strata manager and dreading going home everyday as requesting them to close the door and be quiet leads to them being rude to me.

Thanks also to Flat Chat for the current article you’ve posted about complaining.

Avatar
reddant
FlatChatter
Members
Forum Posts: 11
Member Since:
18/09/2017
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
10
23/12/2017 - 8:36 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

Thoigh the article says at step 4 that you go to an Adjudicator after mediation has failed. I thought Anudicators had been scrapped.

Avatar
JimmyT
Admin
Forum Posts: 4727
Member Since:
06/01/2014
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
11
23/12/2017 - 9:50 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

reddant said
Thoigh the article says at step 4 that you go to an Adjudicator after mediation has failed. I thought Anudicators had been scrapped.  

If you mean THIS POST, it doesn’t actually say you apply to an adjudicator, it says you apply for adjudication.  And a little further down the page it explains that the “paper adjudication” has been scrapped – so no “paper adjudicator” before you to a hearing before a Member. 

I thought it was perfectly clear  – but thanks anyway for leading me to a broken link.

Avatar
reddant
FlatChatter
Members
Forum Posts: 11
Member Since:
18/09/2017
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
12
24/12/2017 - 9:01 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

JimmyT said

If you mean THIS POST, ..

..I thought it was perfectly clear  – but thanks anyway for leading me to a broken link.  

Thanks Jimmy, you’re right. I didn’t read it properly.

Hey there’s more broken links, for example the one within “NCAT ORDERS”.

Very useful article, so request they be fixed, pretty please.

Thank you!

Avatar
reddant
FlatChatter
Members
Forum Posts: 11
Member Since:
18/09/2017
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
13
25/12/2017 - 7:58 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

“In the past the police have told us that excessively loud voices at the wrong times in the wrong places can be subject to noise abatement orders.”

I went to my local police station at Kings Cross today and the nice constable said the same thing and encouraged me to call them next time it happens. I’m going to call the police next time it happens and I hope they agree it’s offensive noise.

Forum Timezone: Australia/Sydney

Most Users Ever Online: 518

Currently Online: peaceandquiet
33 Guest(s)

Currently Browsing this Page:
1 Guest(s)

Top Posters:

kiwipaul: 613

struggler: 459

Austman: 311

Billen Ben: 232

Millie: 214

Cosmo: 172

Kangaroo: 168

considerate band fair: 167

FlatChatFan: 147

daphne diaphanous: 137

Newest Members:

peterx

MilennialZero

LCKat

Lili

hipercube

Liz

tstephen

gbrownie

Who pays

bylawboffin

Forum Stats:

Groups: 4

Forums: 46

Topics: 4467

Posts: 21263

 

Member Stats:

Guest Posters: 241

Members: 5094

Moderators: 4

Admins: 1

Administrators: JimmyT

Moderators: Whale, Sir Humphrey, scotlandx, Lady Penelope