This topic contains 6 replies, has 5 voices, and was last updated by scotlandx 3 weeks, 2 days ago.

Viewing 7 posts - 1 through 7 (of 7 total)
  • Author
    Posts
  • #37857
    Avatar
    Nice Landlord
    Flatchatter

    I live in an old building where half the lots are two bedroom and half are one bedroom. Two bedroom lots over two bedroom lots. One bedroom lots over one bedroom lots. Bedrooms over bedrooms, kitchens over kitchens. All are laid out the same way

    An owner wants to totally renovate his one bedroom lot and turn it into a two bedroom. Owner has spent money on engineering and architect plans. Owner also wants to relocate the kitchen.

    At the first EGM, the motion for change was soundly defeated 20 against and 2 for. After various “we will sort this in NCAt, you are being unreasonable threats, the owner has re-jigged plans and has put the  motion again. There remains the issue of turning a one bedroom into a two bedroom and moving a common property wall.

    Is the following, in Flat Chat’s view, sufficient argument at NCAT , given applicant must prove owners are being “unreasonable”

    1. Is it unreasonable to refuse the owner permission to change a one bedroom into a two bedroom because other owners are all on the same water bill (no one has own water meter and to do so is cost prohibitive) and an increase of persons may increase common property maintenance? Fewer availability of clotheslines and share washing machines? Longer waits for lift?

    Owners are concerned that approval for an owner to change a one bedroom into a two bedroom could create a run of others wanting to do the same and potentially all one bedroom could become two bedroom.

    Thank you.

     

    • This topic was modified 3 weeks, 4 days ago by Jimmy-T.
    #37889
    Jimmy-T
    Jimmy-T
    Keymaster

    Your local council planning department should have something to say about this.  It’s a change of floor plan and that requires planning approval.

    You could also tell the renovator that you will ask NCAT for orders that the unit entitlements be reviewed at the renovator’s expense – a long and often costly process.

    As far as your objections being reasonable – that very much depends on the NCAT member who hears the case.

    #37891
    Lady Penelope
    Lady Penelope
    Strataguru

    I agree with JT.

    Beware though. If the Lot owner who is planning to renovate his Lot offers to compensate the strata scheme for any additional costs to water usage etc then this may work in their favour at NCAT, and may work against your argument that they are free loading off other Lot owners. The Lot owner concerned would probably be deemed to be acting reasonably in making such an offer.

    Why don’t you place conditions on the approval e.g. that the Lot Owner  obtains the relevant DA and pays any additional costs that are appropriate for this change of plan?

    Unit entitlements can be changed. In NSW unit entitlements are based on the value of a Lot. However, changes to unit entitlements are not automatic and your OC may not be able to change them.

    See https://www.bannermans.com.au/strata/articles/ncat-and-court-proceedings/565-change-of-unit-entitlements

    #37893
    Avatar
    Flame Tree
    Flatchatter

    This sounds peculiar. As mentioned, surely, they’d first need Local Authority permission. You’d think the location of plumbing and services, as well as things like bedroom window provision would come into it, as well as minimum allowable floor space per the number of bedrooms. Things like this matter, otherwise you get folks trying to convert their lock-up garage into a bedsit or convert a one bedder into a 5 bedder if they can get away with it.

    #37895
    scotlandx
    scotlandx
    Strataguru

    It is peculiar. There can be serious issues arising from moving a kitchen. There is a reason why kitchens and bathrooms are located in the same place in a block, aside from anything else how would you like a kitchen over your bedroom or living room? We had an owner who wanted to put a toilet in what is essentially a pantry at the entrance to his apartment, we said no for a variety of reasons including the plumbing, the space being too small, and not wanting a toilet directly adjacent to the foyer,

    They definitely need Council approval, and they may not get it, depending on the size and configuration of the apartment.

    I don’t think there is anything wrong with the owners refusing approval, provided they have reasonable grounds to do so. The water usage reason might be a bit thin, but certainly relocation of the kitchen is a valid concern, loss of amenity for other owners etc. Use of clothesline and lift is also a bit of a stretch. I am sure you can come up with better reasons than that.

    #37896
    Lady Penelope
    Lady Penelope
    Strataguru

    Its not particularly unusual. Wet areas can be swapped if the plumbing is suitable.

    I was successful in changing my 2BRM 1BTH apartment into a 2BRM 2BTH apartment as the laundry was changed to a bathroom, and the washer dryer from the laundry were placed in the kitchen as per European configurations.

    If there is enough space and a window then an extra bedroom could successfully be created.

    People often utilise spaces differently nowadays.

     

    #37899
    scotlandx
    scotlandx
    Strataguru

    Lady Penelope your change entailed changing a plumbed area to another plumbed area.

    In this case, if the kitchen is being moved, then you would assume that plumbing (including most likely gas) and electrics will have to be installed. From what NL has said, there is no swapping of wet areas here.

    I think you may have missed my point, if you relocate a kitchen or bathroom, those rooms are exempt from the usual rules applying to floor coverings and sound insulation. If you are the hapless person underneath a relocated kitchen (or bathroom) you are going to be subjected to much greater sound levels, and there is nothing you can do about it.

     

Viewing 7 posts - 1 through 7 (of 7 total)

You must be logged in to reply to this topic. Login Register