Flat Chat Forum Dirty Linen Current Page

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  • #7510
    Avatarstruggler
    Flatchatter

    We have a few residents who like to hang their laundry on drying racks in their garages.  This is within their lots.  Though there are sometimes items of laundry hanging from garage doors, which is common property.

    The bylaw referring to laundry reads “an owner or occupier..must not..hang any washing…..in such a way as to be visible from outside building other than on any lines provided by the owners corporation…”

    We are a complex of townhouses.  So does outside the building mean from the driveway?  We all have our own clothes lines so the owners corp doesn't provide any.

    This is where I believe bylaws should have “appendix A” etc to distinguish one strata from another.  Definition of “outside building” would mean one thing for an apartment block, another for this?  Do we take this to mean outside the individual unit or from the street?  Can residents argue that the OC should provide lines that facilitate drying better in the colder weather?

    As I struggled to nagivate through the myriad of clothes drying racks positioned around my unit, I do sympathise with the plight of drying washing in this cold, grey weather with the prospect rising power prices.  I do not, however, wish my home and its surrounds looking similar to a street market in Bali.

Viewing 15 replies - 1 through 15 (of 45 total)
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  • #16891

    Hi All, I believe in addressing both the asthetics as well as the practical and cost saving. What we have in our plan is an outdoor area with clothes lines that have screeenining walls. We also approve of drying of laundry on balconies and courtyards using a clothes horse so long as the height is not above the height of the balcony railing and NEVER is laundry to be hung over balcony railings. I think I have posted this previously. We need to consider first of all the appearance of our plan and property value, we do not wish to appear a shanty town but with increased electricity costs it would be just plain stupid to not dry laundry naturally.

    I believe the Strata Regulations are now changing to reflect this.

    cdinoz, have you checked the bylaws for your plan? Look carefully at the wording you may not actually be in breach!

    Cheers CBF Smile

    #16893
    Avatarleif
    Flatchatter

    @Very Nice Landlord said:
    apartmentalize

    I appreciate your post & information however, as installing a new hills hoist clothes line in the back yard is adding something new to common property, we actually require a special resolution which is at least 75% of the votes.

    Lot 4 has 45% & this has been the cause of many of our problems.  In effect, if Lot 4 calls ‘poll’ on votes (& has done so many times in the past) we cannot add to, change, or alter common property.

    They have said that if/when they move back to the property, they will remove the clothes line.  They do not care that their tenants, with their 1 year old baby, value this clothes line greatly.

    We have a drop down clothes line in the shaded side yard but the position in which we have installed the hills hoist (ie 3 of the 4 owners with a combined unit entitlement of only 55% WITHOUT authorisation) is the sunniest part of the back yard, near the common laundry which, to us, is common sense.  We have tested many, many, many things in the Tribunal but this time, we just DID IT as we are SO over the many months & application fees to achieve something that is so common sense, it is not funny.  Our view now, is let him remove it if he ever moves back (so not going to happen as he has a adult family of 4 that he squeezed into a 2 bedroom unit for 10 years) & we will address it then.

    I am still interested in the view of others about his rationale of it not being nice for his ‘view’ of the property.  Also, some prospective buyers of Lot 4 have said “Oh, isn’t this back yard all our own?” & when told no, “Oh, so who uses this laundry & who uses this clothes line & do we have to see other people’s underpants on this clothes line?”  I admit, our property is poorly designed but I have seen so many other properties with facilities in the common back yard & their owners don’t carry on like this dude.

     

    It is a losing batle

    We have no common property clothes line but all Lots have a small balcony with a clothes line that can not be seen from the street but several still use the balcony for drying washing.

    When the item is raised at the AGM the strata agent recomends no futher action that is supported by the majority of members attending that hang their washing on the balcony visible from the street

    #17500
    Avatarcdinoz
    Flatchatter

    @Juan Durection said:
    Why not just do as they ask, cdinoz, and stop the action that is offending someone and is against the house rules and which they are asking you to stop? Put your “small clothes horse” inside in some out-of-the-way place. Seems easy enough to me. Keep the tone and value of the building that little bit better.

     

    Prey do tell, in a small apartment – where does this mythical “out of the way place” exist?

    #17501
    Avatarcdinoz
    Flatchatter

    @considerate band fair said:
    Hi All, I believe in addressing both the asthetics as well as the practical and cost saving. What we have in our plan is an outdoor area with clothes lines that have screeenining walls. We also approve of drying of laundry on balconies and courtyards using a clothes horse so long as the height is not above the height of the balcony railing and NEVER is laundry to be hung over balcony railings. I think I have posted this previously. We need to consider first of all the appearance of our plan and property value, we do not wish to appear a shanty town but with increased electricity costs it would be just plain stupid to not dry laundry naturally.

    I believe the Strata Regulations are now changing to reflect this.

    cdinoz, have you checked the bylaws for your plan? Look carefully at the wording you may not actually be in breach!

    Cheers CBF Smile

    I also think the bigger complexes could actually sell “approved” floor standing lines from the building managing offices.

    And in regards to checking the bylaws – yes, I have checked the small print. The actual small print is also on my actual lease contract, which I could probably win from a semantics perspective (and I do love how courts like being pedantic)…. is that our lease and the bylaws constantly talk about “balconies”. 

    Last time I looked outside my apartment, I was on the ground floor, and not entirely sure where my “balcony” hangs from – being on the ground?

    If my lease stated “balcony / courtyard or other outdoor area” – I would agree I may be breaching by hanging washing outside… but as I live with a small “courtyard” and not a “balcony”…. Wink

    Besides, after I had the last letter from the strata company along with a photo of my courtyard, I called the strata and asked for the name of the person who took the photo, as I was wanting to know who the “peeping tom” was, as I was taking the matter to the police.

    Strangely, I haven’t heard anything since then….

    #16809
    Jimmy-TJimmy-T
    Keymaster

    Yeah, I’d like to read the actual wording of thta strata scheme’s by-laws to see on what grounds they are being prosecuted (or is it persecuted?). Methinks if there was a valid case to answer, they’d have received an official Notice To Comply on the statutory form by now.

    #16811
    AvatarAnonymous

    Please don’t misunderstand me, quote me out of context or verbal me guys. I merely say, if your washing offends someone and they feel strongly enough about it to say something, then simply hang it inside. It’ll get enough air. It’ll dry. Why get aggro about such a thing?

    Further, though, the argument that an apartment with everyone’s washing drying on their balconies or courtyards is aesthetically acceptable doesn’t wash ( hee hee her ) with me.

    #16813
    Jimmy-TJimmy-T
    Keymaster

    Easy, Juan.  Someone disagrees with you – that’s all.  I don’t see how you’ve been verballed or quoted out of context – the context is pretty clear, you don’t think people should have to look at other people’s washing. 

    Fair enough – you are not Robinson Crusoe in that regard, or in thinking that it lowers the tone of a building.  You also think people should comply with their by-laws.  Again, a lot of people (including me) would agree.

    But Apartmentalize obviously disagrees that it lowers the tone of the building.  I take a different view which is that maybe it does but the trade off in what we are doing to the environment is worth it.

    And I asked for the actual wording of the by-law because, at the end of the day,  that’s all that matters in a strata dispute.  If there’s a by-law that cdinoz is breaching, then I’d say that reflects the view of the majority of owners so he or she should  live with it or try to change it.

    But if  this is just some uppity person on the EC getting the strata manager to do their dirty work and imposing rules that don’t exist while snooping on a neighbour, I’d say tell them to get stuffed.

    #16817
    AvatarWhale
    Flatchatter

    Whilst I don’t subscribe to the view that people behave inappropriately on purpose, but rather because they just don’t know any better, Juan’s posts don’t fit that model in my opinion.

    Juan, I think that for some reason you’re regularly and deliberately making contentious statements, some with obscure references that most don’t follow (unless they’re South Park fans), and too often feigning anger and indignation.

    I don’t need to know the reason, but if you can’t add value to the discussions without the aggro then I think it’s time for you to take another “I’m outta here” holiday, lest Jimmy T takes out the red card, because I for one have almost had enough.

    #16821
    Avatarapartmentalize
    Flatchatter

    I should clarify that I don’t think a free-for-all with clothes everywhere is the best outcome, but more in the circumstances presented (concealed courtyard) it seems a better outcome than using a dryer. In general, OCs should encourage outside drying to the maximum extent possible (which may vary depending on the building, its occupants, and their options and choices). I’m lucky in that my apartment block all units have both front and rear balconies, and only the rear are used for drying which keeps the aesthetic nice.

    As Jimmy said though, it all comes down to the specific by-laws, and my experience is, these are widely ‘quoted’… inaccurately… by those with an agenda.

    #16823
    AvatarAnonymous

    Whale, your post is not fair at all. The world needs a contrarian or two. Our High Court will actually miss one of the most famous in the future who was almost always correct in his thinking.

    There are obviously two clear sides to the argument about balcony washing, Whale, and the Flat Chat Forum shouldn’t just be exclusive to one and shout the other down. (By the way, when I referred to the episode of South Park called ‘Smug’ I explained what you refer to as an obscure reference.)

    Now, look up ‘clothes drying on apartment balconies’ on Google Images, like I just did, and get back to me please.

    To JimmyT, Apartmentalize was implying I favour electric clothes dryers over ‘hanging’ which is not true. That’s not fair, is it?

    #16824
    Jimmy-TJimmy-T
    Keymaster
     

    Jun Durection said:

    There are obviously two clear sides to the argument about balcony washing … the Flat Chat Forum shouldn’t just be exclusive to one and shout the other down.

     

    First of all, I think you’ll find the washing on balconies viewpoints are fairly evenly divided here.  Even if they aren’t, people don’t get “shouted down”. You get your fair share of space and if someone disagrees that’s part of the debate that you claim to want. I disagree with you but if I wanted to “shout you down”, your posts would never see the light of day.

     

    Please don’t misunderstand me, quote me out of context or verbal me guys.

    If you don’t want to be misunderstood, it is incumbent on you to express yourself more clearly or at least correct the perceived misconception when it occurs.  I have been writing professionally for much too long to admit in public but I still assume that if someone misunderstands what I’ve written, it’s my fault, not theirs.

    How have you been quoted out of context?  This IS the context. Being quoted out of context is usually an excuse used by politicians who have been caught saying something they shouldn’t have said when they thought no one who disagreed with them was listening (viz Allan Jones, Mitt Romney et al).

    As for “verballing” – my understanding of that is that it’s taking a few words you have said and distorting the intended meaning.  None of that has happened here.

     

    The world needs a contrarian or two.

     

    A “contrarian”, in my view, is summed up be this definition from the Urban Dictionary: “A person who disagrees with the mainstream or accepted view because he believes it makes him look good and feeds his ego, not because his argument is well thought-out or rational.”

    There are other definitions and maybe you didn’t mean that one but if that IS you, please take it elsewhere.  We have enough to do dealing with genuinely held contrary opinions without having people deliberately polarising the discussion, just for the hell of it.

     
    #16827
    AvatarAnonymous

    Gee whiz JimmyT, moderator, I’ve only stated a different point of view a couple of times in my Flat Chat history, on maybe a couple of different issues and just look at what happens to me when I do!

    Well, I suppose it IS your forum.

    I notice Arpartmentalize realised he had, at the least, quoted me out of context and reneged slightly, though I wonder what he means by “those with an agenda”.

    I do hope you will look up ‘clothes drying on apartment balconies’ on Google Images. I’m looking forward to a thread on satellite dishes for balconies too. 

    And thanks for clueing-me-up on how I’m misusing expressions too. I can’t wait to add that Urban Dictionary to my Apps either.

    But on a more serious note, you accuse me of “deliberately polarising the discussion just for the hell of it???” Maaaatttte???

    #16828
    Jimmy-TJimmy-T
    Keymaster

    @Juan Durection said:

    But on a more serious note, you accuse me of “deliberately polarising the discussion just for the hell of it???”

    I referred to “people” deliberately polarising the the discussion …  If I had meant you I would have said you. 

    Good example of quoting out of context and verballing though.

    What a waste of time and space this is.  No more!

    #16829
    AvatarAnonymous

    Boys, as a newbie here at Flat Chat, does anyone really think hanging washing on balconies looks nice? Personally, I’d hate it if someone did that when I was selling my apartment, or I saw it attending an ‘open for inspection’ to buy or lease. I’d walk right on past.

    BTW, having waded through the posts on this topic just now, I think Juan was entitled to think you were accusing him of of “deliberately polarising the discussion just for the hell of it” JimmyT. Everyone has really gone for him.

    #16833
    AvatarFlatChatFan
    Flatchatter

    Morticia,  there are ‘girls’ as well as boys who contribute to Flat Chat.

    Contributors to this thread have given a range of opinions and while washing on all sorts of makeshift or removable lines or airers may not ‘look’ good, I think that we can get used to anything.

    Sydney has had a very cold winter and a hot summer is predicted with possible power worker strikes.  Our latest electricity bill is the highest it has ever been because we needed heaters on for a longer period.  Many people can not afford the latest in heating or cooling and so use more power hungry methods, and try to save electricity by not using dryers for their clothes.

    Maybe Owners Corporations need to look at ways to help people dry clothes in the sun so that is not so ‘in your face’.  Older blocks had clothes drying areas but allocation of lines at convenient times, and sometimes theft was a problem.  Most modern blocks do not have a yard although maybe the roof area could be modified?

    Instead of seeing red tiles when flying into Sydney, travellers would be welcomed by flapping washing!  Cool

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